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| To nons: would anything have stopped your relationship with BPD? | |
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| Topic Started: Aug 10 2009, 02:11 PM (1,479 Views) | |
| laurena82 | Aug 10 2009, 02:11 PM Post #1 |
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Over 100 posts
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Not sure where this would fit, and I dont really think there are alot of answers for this. But here goes. (disclaimer: this has NOTHING to do with non/nonnon's ect. Not even sure if any BPD is involved. Just HUGE concerns over red flags re: my youngest (age 19) son's GF.....(e.g., unhealthy personality traits in GF (3 years older than he) that ARENT going to disappear). This is essentially his "first" serious relationship (read: sex involved), so that thwarts his views even more....) to Nons: In retrospect, for you, I'm wondering,.....do you think there is ANYTHING that ANYONE could have done/said/suggested/...whatever!......when you were early in your relationship with your (now) BPDx....that would have given you pause to reconder.....and ...**POSSIBLY** prevented you from continuing relationship? |
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| Frog | Aug 10 2009, 02:16 PM Post #2 |
Over 100 posts
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My experience was that NO ONE said anything! They were all very polite and PC. No one said anything until after we were divorced. I'd like to think that if someone had tried to talk some sense into me before it was too late, that I would have done something. At the time, we just joked about it. I was told I "had my hands full" etc. Yeah, I know, I thought, but I can handle it! 
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Il est dangereux d’avoir raison dans des choses où des hommes accrédités ont tort. [It is dangerous to be right in matters where the established authority is wrong.] -- François-Marie Arouet (Voltaire) ◘ about: Frog | |
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| gary | Aug 10 2009, 02:17 PM Post #3 |
Over 1000 posts
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For my self....No. My reasons (that I didn't know then) were to entrenched to have had me go any other direction than the one I did. But to be honest I don't think even in a 2 party healthy encounter would or even should another persons word alone have a final say so weather to continue or not. I would hope that even if I did decide to enter into another relationship and some people tried to talk me out of it with "their" views of her .That I would still (with open eyes now) proceed to find out for myself but with this information front in my brain. Edited by gary, Aug 10 2009, 03:10 PM.
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My Book: "That Soul Belongs To Me" My Web Site: Gary Walters Photography My Blog: http://gawalters.com/blog/ " I started out with nothing and have most of it left " | |
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| MoGlow | Aug 10 2009, 02:19 PM Post #4 |
Madame MoGlow
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FWIW, there's a running "joke" in our family that my older brother married his mother the first time around. NOT a compliment, believe me! I believe he was drawn to and married, quite simply, what he knew. None of us saw it in early days (however some of his buddies did try to talk him out of marrying) but when they separated then got into divorce/custody/child support issues, it was like hearing mommie dearest all over again. (Thankfully wife #2 is nothing like the first OR mother!) |
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Expectations are disappointments under construction. ~ Cap'n Spanky Be the change you wish to see in the world. ~ Gandhi | |
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| gary | Aug 10 2009, 02:21 PM Post #5 |
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Over 1000 posts
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An interesting wrench to throw into your question would be the other side of the coin. Why was that BP willing to have a relationship with us. See they won't have a relationship with just anybody. maybe someone should start that post as well.....frog ....anybody. Edited by gary, Aug 10 2009, 02:22 PM.
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My Book: "That Soul Belongs To Me" My Web Site: Gary Walters Photography My Blog: http://gawalters.com/blog/ " I started out with nothing and have most of it left " | |
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| Charles6722 | Aug 10 2009, 02:31 PM Post #6 |
Over 100 posts
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L-82 Absolutely not! My circle of friends thought I was crazy to up and move 400mi away, leaving my job,friends and family behind...... in retrospect I WAS nuts! IMO-You can't critic the GF but perhaps start throwing out behavioral clues and let HIM figure it out! C.E.- |
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Charles Elliott- "For fool's rush in, Where angels fear to tread" -Alexander Pope | |
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| treadingwater | Aug 10 2009, 02:47 PM Post #7 |
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Over 100 posts
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Nope. I was 19, and knew everything. I DID have people caution me, but I convinced myself that they were wrong....for a host of reasons. As for Gary's question....why did he pick me? I was a doormat with a neon sign. My XH is so so SO very much like my father, it's uncanny (and that's not good). If I could go back in time and NOT have gotten together with him, yes, I would choose that. I'd have to not remember my kids, as I wouldn't want life without them, but OTOH, this "life" they have, isn't one I'd choose for any child. |
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| nowwhat | Aug 10 2009, 02:52 PM Post #8 |
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Over 100 posts
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My dh told me that his friends threatened to kidnap him if he insisted on going through with the wedding. So many people tried to stop him. He did it anyways and he say the red flags on her drinking back then too. He was thinking with the wrong head. |
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| gary | Aug 10 2009, 02:53 PM Post #9 |
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Over 1000 posts
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I'll take my answer a step further. The answer is the same but it did not have to be (that) BP although she was visually interesting as well....But there would have been (some) BP down the road if not her. That I'm certain of. Edited by gary, Aug 10 2009, 02:54 PM.
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My Book: "That Soul Belongs To Me" My Web Site: Gary Walters Photography My Blog: http://gawalters.com/blog/ " I started out with nothing and have most of it left " | |
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| laurena82 | Aug 10 2009, 02:59 PM Post #10 |
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Over 100 posts
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You betcha! I can already tell you why the GF is interested in my DS (and I"m not calling the GF BPD or anything else....just an "unhealthy relationship" for now...) She is a strong personailty, and needs to be the center of attention....hence, she needs a 24/7 following/audience/someone to make her the center of attention. Apparently her family wont anymore. Other people she's around too long wont either. They have been together 24/7 for two months now. The relationship started 2 months ago. His other interests/friends have been ignored (she has no interests in that, or doesnt like him giving attention to friends instead of her). My sweet (OK, I'm the mother) innocent (honestly, this is his first "real" relationship) 19 yo DS is perfect for following her around. She's a good 3 to 4 years older than he is....and THRIVES on the fact that he'll go along with all of her ideas....I dont know that they do a single thing that's his idea...but he doesnt need to present any...she's made ALL of their plans.....she even has an EXCEL spred sheet of his money and her money! (did you catch the part where they have only been together about 2 months?) It's just not healthy. I told him about some of my concerns, and I think I planted a seed that he agreed with. However, there is more. LOts more. Her "conversations" with him, border on abusive. It's just the nature of her personality...but she's critical of him.....he's in the midst of it all...so he doesnt see it.....she "criticizes" him....he thinks about it, and says, "oh yeah, you're right , I should have done it this way".......and doesnt see the insidious nature of it being a frequent/constant /ongoiing thing..... I (the protective mother  ) of course, DO see these things as unhealthy, etc.It's his first "real" relationship....and he has nothing to compare it with. IT would be unhealhty for ANYONE to be with someone like this. IT has nothing to do with me liking or disliking her as a person...I actually LIKE her...but dont want my son in this type of relationship.....and I dont see any way for him to continue in relationship with her WITHOUT these unhealthy aspects....because they seem so much at the core of her personality.....and NOT changing...... BUT....I am SOOOO AFRAID....that *anyything * I say negative will only cause him to *defend* her................... So, I"d be happy for any "advice" if there is anything anyone thinks might actually make a difference..... my gut feeling is that this is something he is going to have to live through....but...aughhhh!!! sitting on the sideline...watching the trainwreck....agghhh!!! About all I can think to do , is try to try to clue him into some things so WHEN he starts feeling uncomfortable...**hopefully** having heard a similar thing from me, it will be a bit validating to him to LISTEN TO HIS OWN GUT INSTINCTS sooner......?? sigh....  |
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| Frog | Aug 10 2009, 05:53 PM Post #11 |
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Over 100 posts
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Sorry I didn't get a chance to start a new topic before I had to got pick up S5 from school (two hour roundtrip and he wasn’t there…grrrrrrr…) Looks like everyone is chiming in here already. Btw, I’m retroactively taking my three-second timeout then, OK? 
Um, yeah, OK, I guess…  I wonder if there’s anything anyone could have said to me that would have made a difference? I would probably have defended TQ and backed it up with a lot of logic but using the wrong CPU! MoGlow, there’s some aspect of “married my mother” to my story, although my mom is a wonderful woman and certainly not disordered as far as I can tell. She’s kinda feisty, though, and I like that in a woman. Laurena would call it a “strong personality” right? My dad was a structural steel engineer, very smart but a very quiet, unassuming kind of guy. He’d probably fit the “nice guy non” profile if he’d had the misfortune to marry a BPD. I was always very much like my dad and my mom would push both of us to stand up for ourselves, whether it was something I was dealing with at school or my dad dealing with at work, etc. That dynamic clearly worked well in their relationship. Following the analogy and, ahem, generalization, my mom would be the nonnon. In my marriage, however, rather than being a positive aspect, “feisty” became screaming tantrums and calling the cops…  One of you can ask GG if she’s “feisty” - I’m afraid to…  If I had to guess why TQ was attracted to me, I’d have to say it was probably my calmness that allowed her to be “feisty” without a fight ensuing (at least early on). She’s had a few tempestuous relationships since our divorce already. I’m guessing the “normal” guys she’s dating just won’t put up with her s%@t the way I would. |
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Il est dangereux d’avoir raison dans des choses où des hommes accrédités ont tort. [It is dangerous to be right in matters where the established authority is wrong.] -- François-Marie Arouet (Voltaire) ◘ about: Frog | |
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| 2bad | Aug 10 2009, 06:10 PM Post #12 |
Over 1000 posts
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I don't think anyone could have done anything to stop me. I was living about 4 hours away from my family, really didn't have any friends outside of work (which included his older sister), we worked together, and everyone seemed to think he was fine. My family may have picked up on stuff, but when we got together, my grandpa was dying from cancer. All of our focus was more on that than who I was dating. And given we got married just 6 months after our first date, it's not like there was a lot of time for the huge red flags to emmerge. I do know that on the day we were getting married, literally standing at the alter, I had a HUGE urge to run far, far away. I should have. But we were out of the country, he had the plan tickets, and I just found out I was pregnant.  As for why he picked me....I think he saw I was nice and I was vulnerable. It was a very difficult time right then. I had just found out about my grandpa's brain tumor a couple of months before we started dating. He knew about it because his sister was our boss and I had requeste a couple of days off to go home for the surgery. Add to that the lack of support system...well, I was a prime target. I don't think I could have made it much easier for him. |
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| Frog | Aug 10 2009, 06:35 PM Post #13 |
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Over 100 posts
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I just remembered something, there was one dear friend of mine at the time (who passed away a few years ago before we got divorced). After he first met TQ he reminded me of some words of wisdom he had imparted previously. He said, "There are some women you want to f%$k and some women you want to raise your kids, and they're not the same women!" I related it to GG a while ago and she said, "Oh yeah the Madonna-Whore" which I just Googled (I had to call her to remind me what it was). Wikipedia says, "this complex often develops when the sufferer is raised by a cold and distant mother," which is certainly not my situation but I thought I'd throw it into the mix as it seems relevant. Perhaps I should have listed to my friend...
Edited by Frog, Aug 10 2009, 06:36 PM.
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Il est dangereux d’avoir raison dans des choses où des hommes accrédités ont tort. [It is dangerous to be right in matters where the established authority is wrong.] -- François-Marie Arouet (Voltaire) ◘ about: Frog | |
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| Screamingfire | Aug 10 2009, 11:28 PM Post #14 |
Over 100 posts
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Oh Laurena I am so sorry to hear that. My sister *is* that type of GF. Her last BF contacted me re:a bday present for her, and when we met up he offered to buy me a coffee so we sat and chatted. Just general stuff for a while...until he started asking me about why she does this that or the other. I should have shut up, I know...but when he told me how she talks to him and is just trying to get him to see reason, I saw red on his behalf. It sickens me she treats men the same, and on some levels worse, than our mother. Eventually they broke up (thank God) and a large part of it was because of friends and what I had told him about BPD. Do I feel like I ratted her out? Yes, I do. On the other hand, she's abusive and controlling. Sister or no, I won't keep my mouth shut when someone tells me in a roundabout way they are being abused. We had one last convo were he mentioned that more than anything, it was the fact that his friends kept in touch with him that helped. My sister likes to isolate people. So encourage him to see his friends. Will he? I don't know. But I do know that in the case with my sister, that made all the difference. And like you say, it's also something he will have to live through and deal with. I wouldn't judge or disparage her, because that just makes a 19 year old more gung ho to keep the relationship going. Be as supportive as possible, keep impressing upon him it's OK to hang out with friends, and keep your own boundaries about what is and isn't acceptable to you. We still learn at 19, we just don't admit it until much later! Edited by Screamingfire, Aug 10 2009, 11:29 PM.
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Let's Start a Revolution: http://anunchosenstruth.blogspot.com/ Care more than some think is wise, Risk more than some think is safe, Dream more than some think is practical, Expect more than some think is possible. | |
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| JohnDee | Aug 11 2009, 01:34 AM Post #15 |
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Over 10 posts
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In retrospect, there were plenty of warning signs at the beginning, that I chose to ignore. I chose to ignore them, because I was being treated well, and made to feel like I had finally found "the one." Later on, as things deteriorated, and I'd been completely isolated from friends and family, I became convinced that all of our troubles were entirely my fault, and that if I'd "just behave differently" then everything would be back where it was at the beginning. The problem is, the expected behavior modifications were constantly changing. Everything I did was wrong. The exact opposite of what I was doing was equally wrong. It was my fault. I "caused" her rages. I deserved it. I "made" her react that way. So, forgive me if I react a little strangely when I start hearing non-nons going on about how the nons "need to do this" or "need to do that" or "need to be educated," because that just smacks of more of the same to me. That aside, I wasn't in a place to hear my sister tell me to get out of the relationship (which she did several times). I wasn't in a place to hear my friends tell me that they thought I was dying. All I knew was that I had destroyed everything I hoped for in a relationship, simply by being alive, and for once again, no matter how hard I tried to get things right, failing, and being punished for it. We (nons) aren't in a place to hear that we need to get out, until we realize it for ourselves. We can't believe we aren't to blame until we hear that other people are going through or have been through similar. Or, until, at last, the BPD partner kills that last bit of love that was left. Nothing and nobody can convince us otherwise. I've read a lot about us being supposedly "addicted" to the rollercoaster ride. That's BS, from my experience. I hated the ride. I just wanted to prove my love. I wanted to stop messing up. I wanted to be the person that I believed she fell in love with, and wanted to correct the ways in which I'd been led to believe I'd strayed. So, no. I don't know if there is anything that could or would have made me see the light, until I was ready to see the light. I was too wrapped up in identifying as being the person who had "caused" all of the problems, and who could do nothing (and I mean NOTHING) right. Sometimes you have to just live through these things, and hopefully make it out through the other side. At least, that's my experience. |
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